Texturing Issue: transparency

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Skyye13
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Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Skyye13 »

Hi guys! I have recently gotten into porting models, and I have noticed issues with transparency. I am currently working on a model of the Valkyr from World of Warcraft, as a sort of training/first character port type thing. So, the deal is this:

She has wings, which are supposed to have transparent sections. However, when I imported the model into 3ds max, using the FBX format, she didn't import with transparency.

So my questions are these:

What is the best way (in 3ds max) to create transparency without an alpha map?
Also, how do I export my finished model with transparent textures for use in XPS? Are there any special requirements or settings I need?

I use Mariokart64's XNALara Exporter, which is really nice and bug free these days :)
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Love2Raid
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Love2Raid »

In XNALara/XPS, transparency depends on the render group (of the mesh) and the texture alpha channel. You need to use a render group that supports transparency (see here: http://sticklove.com/viewtopic.php?f=8& ... f67#p47819 ) and the 'diffuse map' texture needs to have a proper alpha channel.
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Runa
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Runa »

IN 3DS Max you can open the material editor pressing M, applying the diffuse texture also to the Opacity slot. Then, if you click on the little sphere there, on the left you can set the map to Alpha.

If you have problems doing that, you can simply export the model the way it is and then modify the .ascii obtained with the notepad. Change the render group according to the post Love2Raid linked.
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Skyye13
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Skyye13 »

Hey! Thanks for the help guys, I'll look into all that :)

Ok, one more question while I'm at it... and this one could be a tough one.

Ok, so I recall that the XPS format, so far, has a limit of 59-or-so bones per mesh. Another problem has arisen with these WoW models- they import into Max as a single mesh- but they have more bones than the bone limit allows- so I get an error "invalid bone index (bones number)" when I try to export into XNAlara.

Now, I kinda suck at rigging- I know the basics, but its really hard for me to get rigging right, especially with complex models. The WoW models import into Max pre-rigged, and I'd like to avoid damaging that rig as much as possible.

Is there a way to detach parts of a mesh, to split up the bones, without destroying the skin modifier?

I've heard something about adding an edit-poly modifer, and separating it that way, but it isn't clear on the details.

Any ideas? Thanks again for the help guys, this will really help me produce some nice models :)



EDIT: OK, so I'm having some difficulty figuring out the channels thing. These textures did not come with separate alpha maps... It looks like channel 7 is the best way to utilize this, as it supports diffuse only, with alpha channels. If I add in the diffuse as an opacity map, thereby creating transparency, will it export that way as a mesh.ascii? Or would I need to actually go into the file and edit the code?
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Runa
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Runa »

XNALara has indeed that bones limit problem, but if you download the latest versions of XPS that limit is gone. So you don't need to separate the meshes anymore :) also, with XPS you should be able to save an older format for normal XNALara, so that the model will open properly in there as well (though now almost everyone uses XPS, so I think it's not that necessary to create an older format)

As for transparency, I think the best render group for the alpha is 25, because it allows you to have lightmap, normal and specular applied. With just the diffuse, your model will look flat and with no effects at all.

This is an example of render group 25, using Dante's ascii file:

Image

This is how 3DS Max exports it if you apply the opacity, normal and specular. For the lightmap you need blender to create it, if you need/want a nice ambient occlusion effect (we all use it because it makes the model look more realistic).
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Skyye13
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Skyye13 »

Ok, cool... thanks Runa :)

Ok, so my bones problem is null (thank god)... however, I still get that error when exporting the model. I have always had terrible luck with Mariokart64n's exporter, it is incredibly fragile, and the slightest difference in a model can screw it up :(

I don't know if anyone here can help me with the errors in the exporter, I might have to discuss it with mariokart.

I don't think I can use channel 25 if it requires light maps, I can't even use normal maps with this model, seeing as all it came with was the diffuse map :(

This is WoW we're talking about, the texturing isn't exactly extravagant X3
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Runa
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Runa »

Well, in that case, group 7 will be fine :) it supports transparency. What errors are you getting, btw?
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Skyye13
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Skyye13 »

Well, I was getting a bone error, but I found a fix- I just had to export the model as an FBX, and reopen it, then port it. That fixed the error... I assume it was something wrong with the bone index in the original model exported from WoW.

Hehehe, now there's a NEW problem... has anyone had this as well, basically when I port the model into mesh.ascii format from 3ds Max, then load it into XPS Studio, the bones come out all messed up... for example, I try to rotate the model's shoulder, and a bunch of bones from her torso and left leg move with it... the bone parenting gets all messed up in the porting process. Thing is, the bones are properly parented in the original model, and they rotate properly in 3ds max.

Is there a specific setting in the 3ds Max XNALara exporter that I need to set up? Or is there something with the bone names I need to fix? The bones are all named differently, but in a funny way... a few bones are named according to their location (ie Larm, Rleg, etc etc) But most of them are simply numbered. Do I need to name them all?

This problem should be the final obstacle in porting these models, I really appreciate all the help you guys have given so far :)


EDIT: I have renamed all of the bones, deleted bones not actually attached to the mesh, and tried resetting the bind pose. It STILL comes out broken... all the bone parenting is removed- all of the bones are on the same level in the hierarchy in XPS studio. That would explain why the rotation isn't working... Is there a way to go into the mesh.ascii file and reassign parents? Or is there another way to fix this?

I have tried clicking the "reparent bones" option in the exporter, the same problem happens T.T
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Runa »

That problem usually appears if you accidentally touch the Skin modifier in Max... but also if you rename the bones in there and/or there are bones with the same name. I think you should export the model as it is, load it in XNALara and THEN rename the bones in XPS. The parentings error only move a mesh part in an awkward way... but if you say that moving a bone others follow, then the weights are probably ruined now. But I should see a picture to be 100% sure...
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Skyye13
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Re: Texturing Issue: transparency

Post by Skyye13 »

Ok, thanks for the info... that seems kind of backward and ineffective, making the exporter so you can't edit bones before exporting... Does that also mean I can't delete unused bones before exporting as well? If that's true, then there is no point in even porting these models, because they will all come out so junky they would be worthless T.T

I'll edit this post with an image soon... I'm gonna try a few things in the meantime- I'll try exporting after only removing the unused bones, and exporting without touching anything.


EDIT: It didn't matter... no matter what I did, the results are the same... this is what happens in XPS when I try to rotate bones which SHOULD be fully functional...
Image
Last edited by Skyye13 on Fri Nov 22, 2013 10:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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